By Henry Uche
FCT Minister, Nyesom Wike, in this interview monitored on Channels TV, spoke on various issues including the state of affairs in Rivers, his home state.
The Igbo and Ogoni people’s conference, governorship zoning system, shouldn’t a sitting governor automatically get a chance of first refusal?
First of all, I don’t see any law in our country that says you must have the opportunity of the first refusal. I watched it when I was in the office. I went out for inspection to view the Security Command for the security of FCT, I came back and I watched it on channels.
Now Rivers West, which is where you have Odili, they have produced governor. Rivers East where I come from, we have also produced a governor. The only senatorial district that has not produced a governor is the River South East. And today, by the grace of God, that is where the governor comes from, which is the Rivers South East. Now, the configuration of that area is, the Ogoni has the largest; the Ogoni and Onyigbo have five local governments which are the largest, while the two other local governments which are the Opobo-Nkoro, the ijaws are the minorities of that local government. For me, when I was still there, I said look, give and take, I believe in fairness, God never made a mistake why he put us together so that you live and let us live. The Ijaws have been clamouring for these and that and that. My problem with people, you think you are the smartest people, you think that you are the only one with vocal voice, you think you are the one who can intimidate, you think you are the only one who can threaten people and have the monopoly to kill, which is not good. I found out, the Ogoni were running, I called them, I think we can do better, let’s give everybody a chance, all these Riverine, River this and River that, we are Ijaw, we are these and that and that. It was me, I spoke with the Ogoni, I sat down with them, they have the majority with the Onyigbo, I said all of you running, please in the name of God, please please, I did it. You see in this world we are in, if you are a bad man, you are a bad man and people shouldn’t thrust you. It’s only politics that exposes us, that tell us the kind of human beings we are, to tell us the kind of characters we are. Now I call them- it was a bitter pill for them to swallow, the Ogonis, all of them. Because they believed they lost. A majority of the three senatorial Districts? And you are telling the minority of minority to produce a governor- which are the Ijaws, in fact, particularly the Opobo, I am telling you this.
Are you calling them minority because of their number?
What are you talking about, of course the number, in fact, the voting strength of Opobo cannot match my own ward in my state. I pleaded with them- the Ogonis. It was a bitter pill for them to swallow.
But it was not fair to them.
Well, well sometimes in politics, you know this is fair or not fair, but I am just trying to look at peace in our area. You know the funny part of it, people like Edwin Clarke you know I have always said I don’t want to reply to Edwin Clark, because he never believes that the Opobos were the Ijaws; never, never one day, never. People like Edwin Clark, they said he’s an Octogenarian, he’s this…he is that…
He is an elder statesman
That is what people are saying
That is who he is
Elder statesman is not by age.
He is the leader of the Ijaw People
I don’t know. I’m not an Ijaw man, so I don’t know. I was never there when they appointed who will be the Ijaw leader. So, I don’t want to comment on whether he is an Ijaw leader. I am not bothered about that and I’m not part of it. But the point I’m making is that he refused, he said, even if you want to bring an ijaw man, why should it be an Opobo? I’m telling you this! Now, everyday Edwin Clark comes out. He says this and that, you see, Edwin Clark is not from Rivers, he is from Delta State. Ask Edwin Clark, the Octogenarian, the leader, when has he ever produced governor as an Ijaw man in Delta State? Never one day! Never one day! Octogenarian, elder Statesman, the most intelligent man as long as Niger Delta is concerned, the man who knows it all! Well, he’s from Delta State, an Ijaw man, has he fought for an Ijaw man to be governor of Delta State? This is where I sat down, pleaded with the Ogoni, and I said, please, let’s have peace. Let everybody just live together. As an Ikwere man, I could if I wanted, say no, Ikwere man should go back. But is that proper? We are all one country. We are all one state. Now what you have done is if you have now turned it to say it’s an Ijaw affair, you have now weakened the Ogoni, we now begin to say, look, oh, you knew we were here, we considered all these things we did was stupid, was useless, now we don’t matter again. All you are talking about is Ijaw, Ijaw, Ijaw, so all these sacrifices we made to keep the majority in our Senatorial district to go for it, you’re now calling us stupid. You are now saying we are useless. Is that what you’re supposed to be? Where do you go and generate all this kind of thing? Okay! It’s okay. We can’t continue with this. We are majority in this senatorial district. We have five, four local governments, including Onyigbo, we have five, and we are bowing down to two local governments? Why will we continue to do that? This was what we said, look, why are we doing this? Well, you see what have happened, see what people like Edwin Clark, see what people like Ada George, see what they have done! Something that has never happened, I said everybody calm down.
But do you regret what you said that you will put fire in some of the states; Edwin Clark criticized it and said the police should arrest you…
I have always tried not to respond to Papa Edwin Clark. I have always tried, I’m human, they know I am human. Edwin Clark is not fair. Edwin Clark does not love Rivers State. He is not from Rivers State, he is from Delta State, for Christ’s sake, for crying loud, is he from my state? Now let me say, talking about PDP, is he a member of PDP? Let me see his membership card. Let me see when he contributed to PDP. Let me see how much he has given to PDP, to fight for PDP, to win in Rivers.
You said you are going to put fire in states…
I said to the governor’s forum, and I repeat, without any apologies to anybody, anybody anywhere, for Christ’s sake, for crying out loud, heaven will never fall. In fact, when heaven falls, there will be peace! You mean, as I sit as the minister of federal capital territory from Rivers State, I was a governor, yes, the only person I can say, I have no relationship, I never knew about his election or whatever, is governor of Zamfara. I don’t know him. If I see him, I won’t even know him. I have not been there. All other governors, I know them. They know me. They have a relationship. And you mean that you want to violate the processes, the constitution of our party. You came out on a public national television after a meeting led by the of governor of Bauchi state, the chairman of PDP Governors’ forum who came out to read a communique with his colleagues that they are going to make sure their brother, their friend in Rivers State, will take their instructions. It doesn’t matter whether it is illegal or legal. It doesn’t matter. It does not matter whatever process they take. And I’m sitting as a minister of FCT from that state. You look at it that there’s nobody in that state, you made such a statement, and I should fold my arms, because you said you are a governor, which I was never before. And you look at me and tell me that? So you are telling me I should fold my hand to say, everything will be well?
Is that the reason you will put fire in their states…
You are trying to cause crisis in my state Politically, what do you want me to do?
One would imagine that politically speaking, Governor Fubara becomes automatically your political leader in your party…
No, let’s not go there. The subject matter, what you asked me, so we will go to the next stage, before we talk about leadership or no leadership. You see, that’s why we should not mix up issues. You ask me here about what they are saying that I said, I will put fire.
Yes but do you regret that statement?
How can I regret, I didn’t make any bad statement.
Your statement connotes violence
It’s not correct. It’s not correct. Where is the violence? Which fire? It is a speech. What did I say? It’s a matter of saying look, you want to cause crisis in my political system, in my state, you too will also have crisis. I never said that Bauchi state will be on fire. I never said that Oyo State will be on fire. What is my business? All I am saying is, you don’t want my state to be politically stable. You want to illegally, unconstitutionally interfere in a legitimate process, in a legal process that is going on; and you want me to fold my arm to say, because you are a governor, because you are a chairman of the governors’ forum, or because you are members of government forum, you come to my state, people took Form, people have been elected, people have been sworn in. You will use their position to now say NWC, NEC cancel it, we are governors, who told you I don’t have that capacity to say, you too, in your state, that crisis will be there. I’m not talking about going to Bauchi to go and burn Bauchi, I didn’t say I’m going to Oyo to burn Oyo, I didn’t say that, on national television.
So, if you have power, you cause crisis in those states?
Not if I have power, the word has nothing to do with power, we are all politicians. You have tried to use your power to cause crisis in my state. No problem. I have the capacity to withstand it, me too. We will see how in our own little way too. We are all politicians.
But why do they see you as an outsider in your party? You say you have not left
There is nobody, no governor today in PDP, not anybody born of a woman can say I am an outsider! Who?
They are perceiving you as a mole. You’re working with the APC government, you have your one leg in PDP on one hand and the other on the other place.
Before I took this appointment, I wrote to PDP. I wrote to PDP national, I wrote to PDP Zonal, I wrote to PDP in my state. My government also signed the letter. I should take the appointment. Yes, it’s true. The Zonal party wrote I should accept. Who in PDP did not write, nominate names to president Tinubu for appointments.
They did?
Yes. Let them come to say they did not do it! You see the problem we have in this country is that some people think they are too smart. They want to use people, I’m not that kind of person. What I want to do, I will do, what I will not do, everybody knows I won’t do it. They say I’m a mole, who is that person, I dare anybody in PDP to come out on national television. I dare any governor, I dare any national member to come out on national television to say I’m a mole. Let anybody come out.
Is your heart 100 percent in the PDP? They said you are holding two structures in one state.
Look, in 2023 did I not say I won’t support you for president? Did I do it at the back? Did I not say I won’t support you, this is not fair, it’s against equity, against justice. Did I do it at the back? Did PDP not win the governorship? Did PDP not win in the national assembly? Did PDP not win in the state assembly? I challenge any of them. Let us see in many of these states that criticize it, where they have 100 percent as we have. What does it tell you? Leadership! leadership!
Are you worried the kind of political crisis it could cause if you support an Ogoni or Onyigbo person for governor in 2027 since Fubara is a sitting governor?
I have not told you I’m supporting anybody, I never said I will do! All I say because of what they are doing, the Ogoni people have now come up with the same thing. It’s like we made a mistake.
Isn’t it dangerous?
What is my business? Am I the one who is saying, Ijaw, Ijaw, Ijaw?
But as a political leader in that state, how do you see it?
The Ogonis have a right and the Ijaws have the right to make a statement they have made, whether it will materialize or not, is a different thing. We have a political family who will sit down, listen, this thing you are saying, let’s look at it. Is it workable, is it not workable? But to say, they have no right to say what they said, it’s totally out of place. I will not be part of that.
If peace comes, would you side with governor Sim Fubara?
To do what? Don’t use that word. I will never support Fubara in my political life again!
Why?
No, I won’t do that. Everybody knows me.
He is your political godson
Oh no, please, sir, please, sir. I will not do that. That’s why people know me. I won’t do that. Everybody knows that, and I cannot…
What did he do to you?
No, no it’s not about me. People laboured to put up a structure. People laboured where you wouldn’t have even taken the fifth position. People laboured. I sacrificed to talk to the Ogoni. I sacrificed to talk to several people. Let us go this way. Let’s see how things go, you turned it that I’m asking for N20 billion, N100 billion.
Is that the case? Is that true?
That is what I’m saying. You told all lies against me, I brought you up. Put you here. Put you here, push you here, today, I turned to be, hey, Wike is over demanding. What is Wike demanding? In every politics, in every political family, you run election under people and people believe that law. We are all together. We must have to keep our political structure. There is nobody that ever said that, no, you kill your people. You rose through somewhere. Why do you deny it? It’s unfair.
What were your demands?
When you say demands, you see, it is so unfair, and that is why I tell people, life is the way it is, you must continue, don’t abandon those who laboured for you.
Is that what he did?
Everybody. People came. Look, let me tell you, most of our problem with the national legal advisor of the Party, when in 2023, we fought with the national party level, after we won election, the National adviser went and brought lawyers to defend PDP in an election petition, they had a meeting to nullify our election. Yes, it’s true. I said, no, I won’t sit here and allow you to bring lawyers for us. We went to court to challenge at a federal High Court. You cannot, that is a legal adviser of the state party can nominate those that will represent them, because I saw it clearly. They wanted to hold the opposition party to nullify our election. We arranged legal proper lawyers who know what to do. You know what happened? We won at the federal high court and the federal high court said no, you cannot, they have the right to choose who represent them. Look, I got the best of the best of the best legal team, name them, all of them, all of them.
And you won the case.
We won from tribunal to Supreme court.
But this issue with Governor Sim Fubara is causing a setback for the development of Rivers… Can you sheathe sword?
No, I’m not interfering with the governance. I don’t want to be there. What Political crisis in the state. Look I had more crises than anybody in this country as a governor, I survived it. You see, if you don’t want to be a leader, if you don’t want to be, if you don’t want to take leadership position, don’t bother to take the position. That is the truth of the matter. You see, I watched one of the elders, former governor of Rivers, Ada George. George was to convening a meeting of the APC. These are people who fought me. These are people who fought me not to be governor. Now, if you are talking about Ijaw man, what would you talk of the Opobo? But I never bother, I never ‘shake’ one day. Now I see him ordinarily, we are all human, Ada George should go before God, God, forgive me. What happened in Rivers State in Okirika, the bush boys and vigilante, do you know the killings in Okirika? Ask George, who are the bush boys? Ask who are the Vigilante? They never had, there was no peace, nothing, ask Ada George, who are the bush boys under him, and who are the Vigilantes? Who they are fighting? I came on board. I said, enough is enough. We can’t continue. When the court gave judgment about who should be the Amanyanabo of Okirika, people came but I said no, I will implement it. They came here. I will not agree, I implemented it. I said no. Look at people who are dying in Okirika. Under me, I had bush boys, my people died, he’s coming now to say, Oh, okay, is he a member of PDP.
You are older, are you willing, for the sake of God and the people of Rivers State to let bygones be bygones and allow peace reign?
Okay, the governor took advantage of the presidential intervention to insult everybody. I’m an appointee of Mr President, and people should understand this first of all. I never had any bargain with Mr President before I supported him. And people should know that. I know that clearly. I believe in his capacity, and I believe for equity, fairness and justice, and I never hid my intention of what I’m going to do, of what my friends and myself are going to do. Now, when Mr president called, for Christ’s sake, he is a president of my country, there are things I should not have accepted, but he’s a president, and he is our father by his age and whatever; he is old enough to be my father. And he appointed me. Why would I say no? Now, what the governor did was to take advantage of that time period, Mr President said do this and this, then he said okay, he is appointing back the commissioners. He is doing this, he is doing that, let us say, you submit your budget, I refused, and then what he did was to tell people to go to court. And there was a lot of litigation, I laugh. Come on. At my age, at the level I play politics. Somebody will come and tell me that? Then he went to some people in the villa, and they started playing schemes, am I a kid for Christ’s sake? I’m not one anybody can say, you can tie me, no. I owe my loyalty to Mr. President. And Mr president know I told him, I think at this point, at this point in time now, I cannot continue with this kind of characters. The president said, do this, do this, do this. And people went back to tell him, don’t worry, play, buy time. And they went and instituted over 40 litigations.
But there are those who will say, Wike will never allow this kind of thing to happen, if he were…(cuts in)
What do you mean Wike would not allow this to happen… did Wike allow any crisis in his state? What are you talking. Look, the Federal Government is not fighting you. I was fought by the Federal Government of this country under Buhari, which governor faced what I faced under Buhari? Be it APC, be it PDP, be it Labour party, no one can say they faced what I faced. APC can tell you what they did to me,
Is federal government fighting Fubara?
What will it take for peace to happen?
Which peace, peace is to obey the law, the rule of law. Why will you support a man who does not want to obey the rule of law? Why would I support impunity?
Are you worried that PDP is coming after you? They said you will face disciplinary…
No PDP is coming up after me. Who is the one that will come after me? Who is the person, who will face disciplinary action?
They said party is supreme
That is why I’m doing everything for the party, who has supported the party more than me? Look, can I tell you something, I was a governor in this country, the former IG from Niger State, I have forgotten his name now, I woke up in the morning, they took away all my aides, the governors forum never came out to say how can you take away a governor’s aides and this, and everything. When it happened to the man in Anambra, former governor, Willie Obiano, they now started talking, I laughed. I went to Edo State. I led the campaign for Obaseki right, I went there, the IG declared that I must leave Edo, I said I’ll not leave Edo. I came there, Hope Uzodimma was there, Omo-Agege was there under APC, and you asked me to leave, I will not leave. Do you know? I was Sabotaged, yes, Obaseki told Tambuwal not to issue any statement, I was declared to leave. Meanwhile, I was the chairman of the campaign in Edo State, right? They chickened out. I went to court. I told the Federal Government about police Trust Fund. They all ran away. They all ran away. I went to court, federal High Court in Abuja, by the grace of God, we won, right? I was one who went on with that matter. They all chickened out. Yes!
So you fought the Federal Government?
No, I didn’t fight the Federal Government, I was fighting against injustice.
Why the fallout between you and Governor Obaseki? Because you supported him?
Okay, thank you very much. Do you know who is Anthony Aziegbemi; PDP chairman in Edo state, people who have no character.
Why would you say that?
No, he does not have character. He knows. He does not have character. Let him come and challenge me. You see, money is a terrible thing. Let him challenge me. How he became chairman of the PDP. I, Wike, played a role. Yes, it’s correct. He can’t say so when his governor, Obaseki came to meet me when I was saying we were scouting to support Ighodalo, they didn’t know that the REC was my cousin. When Obaseki brought Ighodalo to my house two times to support him, they didn’t know that the REC is my cousin. It’s just today, they now knew that we are cousins, you were posted more than one year ago. Now, see, the problem I have in this country. When they came to me, I said, I’m not going to support you, neither am I going to support anybody. The one I supported, it never helped anything, rather I was insulted upon that.
So you told governor Obaseki that you were not going to support him…(cuts in)
Ask him! Yes, ask him, ask them. I told them.
Why wouldn’t you support him though? You supported him the last time, what happened?
I became a stupid man. I became somebody…you see I don’t like ingrates in life!
So, you are not supporting APC too.
Am I a member of APC? I’m not a member.
They are alleging anti -party activities against you ….
Who is the one alleging? Who is the Edo PDP? If they have the guts, let them come out on national television. They don’t have the guts.
But they said it, Don Pedro and…
Who is Don Pedro Obaseki? How do you reduce me to Don Pedro? Listen, let me tell you, Don Pedro couldn’t make him win 25 percent for PDP in 2023. Who are these characters you are talking about? Is he not aware that Obaseki came to see me to support their candidate? Is he not aware? Yes, he did of course just recently! Is he not aware Obaseki brought his candidate to see me in the house where I live now? And I told him, I will not do anything. I won’t support anybody. I want to stay neutral now. Let me tell you the mistake they made, for accusing my first cousin, they think, I was thinking I’m strong, you’re meeting a rock. He will not, you can never! let me tell you, even the INEC Chairman cannot tell you what to do. He will tell you, go to hell with your job! You see the problem with Nigeria is that, until you kowtow; so more than one year he has been there, he never know he was Wike’s cousin.
But he said you influenced his appointment, is that true?
Why should I? What sort of appointment. So, I will influence my enemies’ appointment. I should go and influence my enemies’ appointment nah?
So, you influenced his appointment.
So if I hear that he has been appointed, I should go to call Imam, call pastors, please don’t allow my cousin to be appointed. I shouldn’t say, please help for him to be appointed. What nonsense is that? If you remove him now, will he not go to another state? Will there not be election there? We have done all the election in another state. For Christ’s sake. The former government brought him; in 2019, you know, it was a war in Rivers, the army came. I stood it. In 2015 when the National Assembly and State Assembly elections were all nullified, by the Court of Appeal, we went for the run. Do you know what happened? The military came, we stood. 2019, from my second tenure, the military came. The GOC came, who didn’t know what happened. I stood firm. I said, okay, the people will react. The people will go to the ballot. What is all these? Every time you accuse this person, you accuse this person. If you are not prepared for election, if you are not prepared for leadership, forget it! I am prepared. Let me tell you. You know, I came here. I was appointed as minister. The day I was appointed, there were all kinds of conspiracies; North, South, West, Christian, Muslim, this, Wike, I said to hell! It would not work. I will not agree. Even in the FCT secretariat, there are those who felt they’re untouchable, I said, get out from here! I’m not this kind of person you can do that…I came here to do what I’m doing, the work of the president who appointed me, and he should be happy.
Yes, you are doing well in infrastructure, what are you doing about human capital development?
I don’t owe them that; you see, what I owe the people of the FCT, what I’m doing in FCT, is stage by stage. Finish from here, we move to the next stage. So, there are people you cannot satisfy. You cannot satisfy them, So don’t bother. Be focused. Do the work you want to do. I have planned what I’m going to do, what we are going to do by next year, I have told Mr. President, this is my plan. By next year, Mr President, 2026, see what I’m going to do. Mr President, by the time you finish your first tenure which ends in 2027, see where we will be.
So, you are planning a Security Command and Control Center in the FCT?
Yes, of course, but I don’t want to let out the cat from the bag, but yes, it’s true. But the details, I will not let you know, these are things that I will want to surprise people. See what we are doing in the rural areas and the rest. But you see, this night, what is important for Nigerians to know, anybody saying that they should remove me, okay, take, for example, they said, I’m controlling PDP national working committee. Is it not true? The same people had a press conference to remove my cousin, yet I’m controlling them! You know, they blow hot and cold. Today it favours them, yeah, you are controlling national working committee; today it does not favour them, the national working committee, they are doing the right thing. Anything that concerns Wike, if I have anybody, he is not a Nigerian, he should not be appointed, and let me tell anybody who cares, I don’t care what you think. You can never intimidate my cousin, who is that? You can’t. It is blood! He will do the right thing. It is blood, like I am, you cannot intimidate me. Nobody can. Nobody has that capacity. Nobody born of a woman can tell me that you will do this or to intimidate me for what? So, if you are thinking that you bring him down because it’s Wike, take him to Sokoto, take him to Katsina, take him to Bauchi, he will stand firm.
They are alleging that you are working with your cousin in alliance with the APC
If you can mention those who say so, I’ll tell them these are the people who are working for APC. I think I have told you here, no governor, not any top ranking PDP person, not even house boys can come out of national television and say, Wike, I have facts about you. You are working for APC. I have never denied that I did not support Asiwaju, I never denied. I can tell you those who came to me, to lobby me to go and support Asiwaju before even I decided. But time has not come. I will speak about that at the appropriate time.
Are you worried that the PDP government is better than this government that you are working with, given the harder, harsher conditions of living
Okay, Let me start from somewhere. Let’s start from FCT, tell me what is the result. PDP was there, the last government was there. You see, you don’t make a general statement. Let’s take it stage by stage. How do you compare this government in FCT and the other government? Then I will now go into other things, answer me. Let’s start from where I superintendent now. The problem with Nigeria is that we don’t go back memory. What did this government meet? How was the country? How was the state of the economy? And I will tell you the simple truth. I’m sorry. Some people will not be happy about it. The present government did not reveal the decay of the economy of this country as at when they took over. With all due respect. I’m sorry. I’m sorry. In fact, as I speak to you, with all the efforts they are doing, you see, when things are bad, we begin to, it takes time, I mean, you know, Nigerians are also not patient. They don’t just want to hear excuses. I don’t care that it was bad. You come to redeem it. So, redeem it. We don’t know the steps you take or how long it will take.
